Former pastor Roger Morimoto has been using the Enneagram for over 36 years. He first learned the Enneagram from Helen Palmer. He was so intrigued that he made it his life’s work to master the tool. Here he shares insights about how he used the Enneagram as a leadership tool from the perspective of Enneagram Type 8. He also describes his personal journey of growth.

[Video Transcript]

Matt Schlegel:

Thanks for joining me in conversations with leaders who are using the Enneagram as a leadership tool and a tool for personal growth and development. Today, I’ll be speaking with Roger Morimoto. Roger is a former pastor who was introduced to the Enneagram 36 years ago by none other than Helen Palmer herself. Roger became passionate about the Enneagram and has woven it into both his professional and personal lives. Roger currently serves as the director of the Spiritual Life Foundation, and we collaborate to deliver Enneagram sessions and workshops for members. Roger shares his journey to becoming a self-aware Enneagram type 8 leader. So now for the conversation.

Matt Schlegel:

I’m excited to be speaking today with Roger Morimoto. Roger served as pastor at Aldersgate United Methodist Church in Palo Alto for over 20 years. Before that, he served his pastor for 16 years at the United Japanese Christians Church in Clovis, California. Now, he’s the director for the Spiritual Life Foundation. Roger is my Enneagram mentor and we collaborate to deliver Enneagram workshops for the Spiritual Life Foundation. Thank you, Roger, for joining me today.

Roger Morimoto:

It’s great to be here, Matt.

Matt Schlegel:

So just to start off, how and when did you first discover the Enneagram?

Roger Morimoto:

Yeah. My encounter with Enneagram started probably about 36 years ago when I was starting in pastoral ministry. We would have to go off to these continuing education events. But I tended not to go to the traditional ones that were often provided for pastors, but I had attended the Transpersonal Psychology Conference at Asilomar. During that conference, I had at the last minute joined a workshop where Helen Palmer was introducing her book, The Enneagram. That one little workshop just propelled me into the Enneagram in a way that I just… It has become really a lifetime pursuit, and then at the same time, a tool that has been very effective in many ways, both in my ministry and in the past, but also in my personal life and continue to work with it as I work with people in their own spiritual searching and through the Spiritual Life Foundation.

Matt Schlegel:

Right. Wow. So you were introduced through Helen Palmer. That’s amazing.

Roger Morimoto:

Yeah. I’ll tell you, I felt like she, when she was in that workshop, that particular workshop, she didn’t have her panel. It was just her talking about the Enneagram because I think because of the time limitation that she had, she didn’t have a chance. It wasn’t one of her all day workshops or half day workshops. It was like a one hour workshop. But I gleaned enough out of there that it just got me going.

Matt Schlegel:

It sparked you for the rest of your life.

Roger Morimoto:

That’s right. That’s right.

Matt Schlegel:

That is amazing. So when you were first learning the Enneagram, what did you discover about yourself that you didn’t know or appreciate before?

Roger Morimoto:

I think the thing that spoke to me first was really helping me understand my sense of being as an 8. When I say that, I think it helped me understand where, as I looked at my life, where my burst of anger would come from, or on one hand, it helped me understand, on one hand I seemed to be fairly happy go lucky, and other times that I would just have this surge of energy, which was often accompanied with anger.

Roger Morimoto:

So it gave me some way to work with that or to frame that and put it into a different context than perhaps I had before. Then as I worked with that, it helped me also begin to frame that larger context. It was like, okay, this is how I am personally, but it’s like also it made me understand or at least create a new context of my family and then also my friends.

Matt Schlegel:

So you were saying how it helped you in both your ministerial world, but also in your personal and family life as well. One of the things that struck me was that appreciation for that burst of energy that you felt often accompanied with anger. It sounds like the Enneagram was helping you understand that relationship between your reaction and that feeling of anger.

Roger Morimoto:

Exactly. It helped frame it differently. I don’t think I could remember how I framed it in my life before. I probably didn’t even frame it. It was just what happened. It would be reactionary, but the Enneagram an opportunity to understand that what I thought was just strictly reactionary, I could now work with it in a sort of a different context or different understanding, and which really meant that I could work with it really for the first time. I could begin to process it as opposed to just being sort of, I don’t know, a slave to it or yeah, yeah.

Matt Schlegel:

Yeah. This is one of the most powerful things about the Enneagram is it really helps us understand our innate reactions to things and those reactions are perfectly natural. They’re perfectly fine, but it gives us a vocabulary to talk about it, understand it and process it in a new way, almost a more objective way that allows us to better even manage it.

Roger Morimoto:

Exactly, exactly.

Matt Schlegel:

So that’s great. So now, how did you and have you been using the Enneagram as a leadership and team tool?

Roger Morimoto:

Yeah. So I think in that context, that would really be up to the past 36 years of my ministry. I think one of the things that it did was it helped me understand that as I was working in groups, in this case, it would often be church administrative boards or committees that were working on projects, at the very basic level, it just helped me understand where people were coming from. In that process, yeah, I could begin to understand that, okay, this person may be overstepping some boundaries, but I understood why as opposed to sort of applying, and actually applying that, oh, they were a troublesome individual. It would be like, okay, I kind of understand where they’re coming from.

Roger Morimoto:

So sometimes I would be able to then, utilizing the understanding of the Enneagram, kind of guide that person in a different way to who process or to be a part of the group. I think in general, one of the things that people have said about my ministry was that they tended to see me as a good communicator, but I think a lot of that communication came out of the understanding of who I was speaking to, what were the dynamics within those individuals in terms of their processes so that we could work together on projects. For the most part, make it a little bit more constructive as opposed to just being an issue of conflict or differences of personality.

Matt Schlegel:

Right.

Roger Morimoto:

So I think that would be, at the most base level, that was what was most effective about the Enneagram.

Matt Schlegel:

Right, right. That is such a brilliant way to use it. Once you first start by knowing your own Enneagram type, but then as you learn the Enneagram, the other Enneagram types, and particularly the types of the people that you’re working with on your team, now you can speak with them and frame things in a way that is most meaningful and impactful to them and kind of really meet them where they are in their perspective. That is just amazing for improving communications with those team members.

Roger Morimoto:

Exactly. Then a part of that was always then also catching myself or trying to check my own reactions, because no matter how much we understand about the Enneagram, we still have that innate initial reaction to the triggers that people have set off in us. So it’s both looking at others and then also looking at myself as well.

Matt Schlegel:

Absolutely. Yeah, very well said. So, Roger, what advice would you give to other leaders of your Enneagram style, an Enneagram type 8?

Roger Morimoto:

For leaders that are 8s, it is this really this process of going back and forth. One, utilizing it in terms of looking at others, but also constantly checking back to about ourselves. It’s like are we just acting out also of our own Enneagram type? Are we utilizing our anger? Did somebody upset us that then it’s easy for us to quickly jump and sort of strike back or to try to make sure things are going to get done and we utilize that anger?

Roger Morimoto:

So we often will easily go to that and feel very justified to go to that place. I would say so it’s really a process of not only just understanding how others work so that we could move the process forward, but it’s also checking ourselves as well, because if we’re not checking ourselves, then in a sense then we could easily begin to move into a space where we’re almost just the bully in the room. When really perhaps there’s a better way we could move things forward than just forcing it and in that way.

Matt Schlegel:

Right, right. Yeah. For 8s, it’s such an effective tool. It serves 8s so well when they’re trying to get stuff done to go into that dynamic, but if you’re going to become even a more effective leader and be able to work in more various situations, sometimes you don’t want to use the hammer. Sometimes you want to pick up another tool.

Roger Morimoto:

Matt Schlegel:

But you have to have start with that realization.

Roger Morimoto:

Yes.

Matt Schlegel:

So that’s perfect, Roger. Thank you so much. I have learned so much from you over the years. I am so appreciative for our relationship and everything that you’ve taught me. I know you have so much to share about this, so I hope that you’ll be able to come back and share more in the future.

Roger Morimoto:

Sure. Thank you, Matt. The same goes with you as well. I meant, you have brought forward so many different ideas and context and your Teamwork 9.0 in terms of how to utilize the Enneagram it’s really… It’s just been a great journey and a lot of fun working with you.

Matt Schlegel:

We demonstrate the power of the Enneagram 8-6 partnership.

Roger Morimoto:

That’s right. That’s right.

Matt Schlegel:

It just works.

Roger Morimoto:

That’s right. It wouldn’t without the Enneagram.

Matt Schlegel:

That’s right. Yeah, yeah. Operating at the higher level, but even the 8 and the 6 can work together. If they do, it’s a powerful combination.

Roger Morimoto:

Exactly. That’s great.

Matt Schlegel:

All right. Well, thank you again, Roger.

Roger Morimoto:

Sure thing, Matt. Okay.

Matt Schlegel:

Bye.

Roger Morimoto:

Bye now.

Matt Schlegel:

Thanks for watching. Roger’s been using the Enneagram for 36 years and that certainly gives him some unique perspective on how the Enneagram can be used as a leadership tool, especially for type 8 leaders. I love the way he grew his self-awareness of his instinctual reactions to situations, especially his reaction of burst of energy often associated with anger and that how he used that self-awareness to better control his reactions.

Matt Schlegel:

I was also impressed how he used the Enneagram as a communication tool and how he became so effective at that that people would remark, “Roger, you’re such a good communicator.” That really shows the power of the Enneagram as a rapport building and communication tool. So if you found this helpful, please click on the thumbs up button, subscribe to the channel and get notifications of future episodes. If you have any questions, please leave them in the comments and I’ll respond as soon as I can. Thanks again.

The post Enneagram Type 8 Leadership Path of Growth — Interview with Roger Morimoto appeared first on Schlegel Consulting.